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[whitewolf]

Guys -the ones who have had some first hand knowledge
when attacking someone does the attacker do repeated stab/slashes or does he attempt a single thrust of some sort from 12-or 3=or 6 -or 9 area?

from what i am studying from hocks book and others i have talked to its getting the knife haan asap-holding while you repeatedly strike at opponent.

comments please as i am getting a lot of questions from students on the overall
unarmed against knife topic.
WW

[Hock]

Many stabs and/or slashes

[whitewolf]

sence i am mostly talking about a robbery against a victim i would say does attacker slash back and forth or just lunge in??? WW

[Hock]

Depends on whats open.

First, high precetage of robbers leave when the victim just presents a knife or gun.
With good "command presence."

Second,
     don't slash when stabbing is better.
     don't stab when slashing is better.

Hock

[TLE]

In the training in I have done- focusing on grabbing the knife bearing limb doesn't work well. This is when attacked by a good sized, agressive, experienced person. Howevever, if the opportunity to grab the limb has been there, it just seems natural to do that. In my experience, avoid , close and cause damage. That is of course if escape is impossible or there is no time to arm yourself.

[whitewolf]

all sounds good-tuesday we will play around and see what happens- WW

[Hock]

But you are asking about if the good guy has the knife...

Hock

 

[Joe Hubbard]

But you are asking about if the good guy has the knife...

Hock

 

WW stated that it was a robbery against a victim.  

It's important to establish the setup before "the attack."  Was there a static presentation, aka The Mugger's 12?  Or, was it a dynamic ambush from a palmed or concealed draw?  It is also important to point out that similar to empty hand attacks not everyone attacks you in a repeated or a series of combinations.  Many will attack - especially with a knife - with a single direct emotional charge.  Hock's system teaches how to defend against an over demonstrative slash or thrust fuelled by emotion. 

Too many people constantly paint a picture of defending against Dan Inosanto on Methamphetamines and because of this create negative reinforcement that nothing will work.  A more highly probable scenario against a robbery is defending against the Mugger's 12 where the Law of Preemption comes into play.  From there practice all of the counters from different draws.  Hock had a list of these in the old encyclopedia.  By all means practice countering the worst case scenario which is the dynamic ambush, but this is extreme late phase which isn't pretty.  

A lot of new fangled knife systems try to define and emphasize this extreme late phase as what will really happen in a knife fight, but you have to practice to whole continuum and understand what is most probable under the circumstances you may find yourself either professionally or personally.


Joe  

[Webby]

I did a chunk of my nursing at Accident and Emergency for....to long.
Here's my 2p's worth. I treated people with knife related single stabs, multiple stabs, slashes and deep hacks. 90% of the stabbing where aimed at the body/head area. Stabbing in the back was common in patents transferred from prison hospital. The people who fought back tended to have more hand and arm injuries and less on the body. The vast majority of stabbing took place in the summer months, on weekends and at night. The people who fared best stayed calm, stayed still, applied pressure to the most severe wounds and kept mentally alert. People who it poorly freaked out and then drifted when the adrenalin rush wore off. If you're stabbed or treating someone who's stabbed the number one thing is stopping the blood loss.

If there is such a thing as a standard knife attack, victim's I have treated have said that that they where stabbed once or twice and then there where multiple slashes as they tried to run. I treated victims who had been stabbed by multiple attackers, they all tended to stab the person in the same place. I did almost two decades of nursing in that time I would say about half of all the people I treated for stab wounds where drunk.

I hope that's helpful info.

Webby.                     

[whitewolf]

to continue-all makes sense to me-i remember in NYC bluffing a attacker off by pretending to have a pistol in my pocket-but thinking back on it i say that he probably would have come at me in a lunge with the knife-dont really know because it did not happen-as i continue reviewing and studying knife fighting tactics ill keep in mind what joe said . i do know that we have to go over and over and over defense when an attacker starts the initial use of the knife-WW

[Adventure]

I have never been attacked with a Knife, except at Hock's seminars, but I have interview all my patients I have had over the years that were attacked by knives. And Webby sums it up well. I pretty much had the same experience. 

Also:

- All mine were attacked & not just mugged, no static display of threat. (this is just for the victims I have worked.)
- No one ever knew there was a knife in play until after the event.
- All were stabbed. I have not had a slasher yet that I can remember.
- Had a kid stabbed in the side of the neck, below the ear....missed everything important.


Adventure.   

[Webby]

Adventure,
              We had a guy in South London two weeks ago impaled on a steel rod thought the head, in a bizarre accident at Elephant and Castle Market. They unstuck him and he's o.k.

Your statement about the victim not seeing the knife during the attack is spot on. Most of the victims of glassing ( pint glass in the face or bottle over the head ) told me that they didn't see it coming or had little or know memory of being attacked.

We would also have victims from repeat locations. The same night clubs or pubs.
The Police referred to them as ' Alcohol Flashpoints ', over-conceration of alcohol outlets in a given locality, they encourage crime and disorder. The guy gets kicked out of one place and goes next door. It's not just London Resent figures from Scotland : One Glasgow reported more than 700 stab/slash knife wounds in one year. One alcohol related death every 3 minutes, life expectancy for men in Glasgow 54.

E-Mail me at spiderwebb3377@Googlemail.com for more info.